WTB SR20DE non turbo

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SaveThatClassic
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Re: WTB SR20DE non turbo

Post by SaveThatClassic »

I appreciate all the feed back and support, either way I will have a cool car.

With a stroker build I am assuming that includes lots of tuning and cams, carb set up, not just slapping in new pistons and rods.

I'm looking to get the specs on a SR20DE from an S14/S15 and see how the stock HP/TQ compare to the R16 stroker. I would ASSUME they would be equal but the SR20DE stock. It would be a nice to have an easy to start, idle and drive with no tuning needed setup. Plus it could be modified with cams/ecu tuning to up performance in the future.

These are my assumptions , I will do more research and reach to the experts here before pulling the trigger.

Also for me SaveThatClassic is company I started many years ago and put on hold while I worked for an EV start up, that is over now so I am reinventing it. For me Save That Classic is about putting classic cars back on the road not necessarily keeping them 100% original, it could be buying a parts car and parting it out help others finish their cars, building restomoded un-restored cars, or full restorations.

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fj20spl311
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Re: WTB SR20DE non turbo

Post by fj20spl311 »

EFI is the way to go if you want a modern "feel" to your classic.
Phil
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Pjackb
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Re: WTB SR20DE non turbo

Post by Pjackb »

SaveThatClassic wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 10:29 am
I appreciate all the feed back and support, either way I will have a cool car.

With a stroker build I am assuming that includes lots of tuning and cams, carb set up, not just slapping in new pistons and rods.

I'm looking to get the specs on a SR20DE from an S14/S15 and see how the stock HP/TQ compare to the R16 stroker. I would ASSUME they would be equal but the SR20DE stock. It would be a nice to have an easy to start, idle and drive with no tuning needed setup. Plus it could be modified with cams/ecu tuning to up performance in the future.

These are my assumptions , I will do more research and reach to the experts here before pulling the trigger.

Also for me SaveThatClassic is company I started many years ago and put on hold while I worked for an EV start up, that is over now so I am reinventing it. For me Save That Classic is about putting classic cars back on the road not necessarily keeping them 100% original, it could be buying a parts car and parting it out help others finish their cars, building restomoded un-restored cars, or full restorations.
Stock S14/S15 SR20s will put way more power to the wheels than any standard stroker some tuning and a cam will take it in another league power wise compared to a stroker if that’s what your after

The recipes for stroker apps are well known (plural because there’s a few depending on engine characteristics) and some searching on the forum will give plenty of options.

I’m not recommending one over the other just saying do your homework first, personally I started wanting a swapped car but now I’m more interested in what we can do with a well built H/R stroker

JT68
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Re: WTB SR20DE non turbo

Post by JT68 »

You are correct, if you just change crank/pistons/rods and nothing else, you will have a stump puller of an engine that doesn't really rev very well. It would have more torque than an SR, not nearly as rev happy. More is required than that, would not want to mislead you there.

As Jacques mentioned before,there is a long list of details to attend to for a high quality SR swap. There are hundreds-prob 1000's of photos on 311's documenting all those details&mods over months and years. Just the fuel system is a chore, and then there is a ton of electrical work and that is after all the "make it fit" frame work.

But i guess it comes down to what you like to do.. Personally I'd rather tinker with carbs and cams rather than cutting and welding fuel tanks and shoehorning an ecu under the dash. If you struggle with carbs an SR/KA might be a better choice. (twin cam KA's make great torque and loaf along effortlessly in 5th-KA parts are inexpensive)
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Karr
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Re: WTB SR20DE non turbo

Post by Karr »

I am currently in the middle of my of SR20DE swap in my 67 1600. In my opinion, the cost really comes down to the condition the car is currently in and what you want it to be. I’m assuming by your budget you’re planning on doing a complete top to bottom restoration so I’ll go with that.

If you have to completely restore your gauges then going electronic might actually save money so it shouldn’t be added to the swap cost. My fuel system is original and needs to be completely redone anyways so that isn’t much of an extra cost.

Main costs for mine: Motor was $1500 (as of 6 months ago) and I had to have it shipped from New Jersey since I couldn’t find a local DE (I’m also in California). From Spriso I purchased mounts, alternator mount, exhaust manifold and rented jug. Also purchased wiring specialties harness. Other odds and ends I didn’t think of were new radiator and fan, water pump, gasket kit, clutch, driveline modification, alternator and complete exhaust.

I will be into mine for around $4k but that’s only because I would have had to replace almost everything anyways. This is also assuming the motor runs great when it’s started for the first time. If my car had already been restored and I wanted to swap it I would easily be in 6-7k.
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JT68
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Re: WTB SR20DE non turbo

Post by JT68 »

So wide number ranges here. Real world is probably somewhere in the middle. Personally I think a 4k job would be an extremely thrifty SR swap and would also be a very lame stroker attempt. 6-10k is more realistic from my perspective (Major Gauge, cooling, fuel system and electrical changes are all pretty much required for an SR swap, not so with a stroker). There are lots of swaps on 311's that are in for WAY more than this.

In the 6-10k range one can build one hell of a stroker, and that is a fresh engine, not a JDM mystery motor.

Regardless of the path chosen, lots of self control is probably needed to avoid going WAY over budget...I know if I started an SR project, I'd probably say "well you know, a turbo wouldn't be that much harder", and that is how it starts....next it is well, while I'm in here a stroker SR crank and some tomei rods would be pretty cool, cha ching.

Hey I'm already in this for 12k, this isn't THAT much more....

https://www.enjukuracing.com/products/t ... F0QAvD_BwE


An awesome swap yes, but it sure isn't 4k.
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SaveThatClassic
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Re: WTB SR20DE non turbo

Post by SaveThatClassic »

Karr wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 12:17 am
I am currently in the middle of my of SR20DE swap in my 67 1600. In my opinion, the cost really comes down to the condition the car is currently in and what you want it to be. I’m assuming by your budget you’re planning on doing a complete top to bottom restoration so I’ll go with that.

If you have to completely restore your gauges then going electronic might actually save money so it shouldn’t be added to the swap cost. My fuel system is original and needs to be completely redone anyways so that isn’t much of an extra cost.

Main costs for mine: Motor was $1500 (as of 6 months ago) and I had to have it shipped from New Jersey since I couldn’t find a local DE (I’m also in California). From Spriso I purchased mounts, alternator mount, exhaust manifold and rented jug. Also purchased wiring specialties harness. Other odds and ends I didn’t think of were new radiator and fan, water pump, gasket kit, clutch, driveline modification, alternator and complete exhaust.

I will be into mine for around $4k but that’s only because I would have had to replace almost everything anyways. This is also assuming the motor runs great when it’s started for the first time. If my car had already been restored and I wanted to swap it I would easily be in 6-7k.
This is very helpful, as your doing this currently , not what it cost 5 years ago.

Yes my 1600 will be a full restoration, I am quite capable of doing most of the work, I can fabricate and I actually enjoy wiring. Paint and body I will pass to those that do it for a living.

I have been building cars the last 25 years, was really into old American cars, especially 63-64 Cadillacs. After working on those boats this roadster is not intimidating at all. I also had the SR20DET 510 that I dealt with the whole tuning part , I also disassembled the entire car so it was good to see all the components needed for an SR Swap (and that was turbo). The DE swap is also cheaper then a the SRDET , I paid $4000 for an S15 DET 6 speed swap shipped from Florida 4 years ago, end up selling it for that locally.

Anyways, I think I still am leaning toward the SR swap, this car has good bones but needs everything (fuel, brakes, electrical, ect..)

Now just need to find one....

eye
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Re: WTB SR20DE non turbo

Post by eye »

Regardless of the path chosen, lots of self control is probably needed to avoid going WAY over budget...I know if I started an SR project, I'd probably say "well you know, a turbo wouldn't be that much harder", and that is how it starts....next it is well, while I'm in here a stroker SR crank and some tomei rods would be pretty cool, cha ching.

Cha Ching!

eye
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Re: WTB SR20DE non turbo

Post by eye »

Yeah you could end up like THIS
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JT68
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Re: WTB SR20DE non turbo

Post by JT68 »

Yep, it wouldn't be the first time.

Guess I'll have to finish building these two SR20DET engines (red top &.black top) some day for you guys who need 300hp roadsters.....

For 135-180 hp a stroker/U is just WAY easier and much less destructive than any swap.
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SaveThatClassic
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Re: WTB SR20DE non turbo

Post by SaveThatClassic »

eye wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 12:50 pm
Yeah you could end up like THIS
:D :D