NO japanese entries for San Marino Concours.

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mraitch
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NO japanese entries for San Marino Concours.

Post by mraitch » Thu Apr 18, 2019 3:26 pm

Just been emailing the Chief Judge for this event and he advised me that there are, currently, NO J cars entered. Period.

Context,

I had a chat with the Chief Judge with regard to Mike Malamut and his pristine collection. There is, likely, NO WAY for an 'enthusiast' to compete. And, I get the impression, that Mike's contribution might be 'show only'

Don't know about that for certain. I do know that he has often 'displayed' his cars for no judging

So merely a question for comments and perhaps impact the future

High Level concours has a class for J-cars - AMAZING

Currently - No entries

why?

too expensive?
don't trust the judges?
too many museum cars in competition?
anything else?
Peter Harrison
1970 1600 (Stroker) - TOAD SAN (Eliza)
1970 1600 (Stock) - As Yet Unnamed
Lake Balboa (SFV) , California

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Re: NO japanese entries for San Marino Concours.

Post by bakerjf » Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:59 pm

The Malamut factor was a turn off for me. I have no problem with him bringing his great cars to show. Or even with him winning year after year after year. The problem is he’s overly-chummy with the organizers/judges, and is a well known “friend of the show.”
At least in 2015 anyway, he was asked by the organizers to recruit cars for the same class he competes in (dumb move). Not withstanding the fact that he found only one other car, and that car was outside the listed class (too new), his pal was permitted to compete anyway. Care to guess who snagged second place (behind Malamut of course) for a totally uninspired mid-80’s Celica convertible?
I shot Aaron Weiss (the head organizer) an email following the event expressing that while I realize there is a tendency by judges to reward “friends of the show,” in doing so they risk poisoning the well and discouraging others from competing in the future. He never responded to it. That doesn’t stop the organizers from sending me solicitations to attend every year though (clueless really). Reminds me of a veterinarian I once had that kept sending yearly checkup notices for my dog that they had put down themselves.
Can’t tell you if that’s the entire reason why the class has collapsed, but I can tell you that is why I won’t go anymore. I won’t name drop anyone else who was also showing a car there the last year I went, but I can tell you I was not the only one who was disgusted by the judging and perceived bias.
It’s really a shame, they have a beautiful venue and a lovely crowd. But it’s just way too much work and expense getting a car ready for an event where the “fix is already in.”
J. Baker
Cupertino, CA
'69 2000 (Solex)

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mraitch
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Re: NO japanese entries for San Marino Concours.

Post by mraitch » Tue Apr 23, 2019 12:52 pm

So far, only ONE J-Car registered. Class will be folded/cancelled if no more entries.

Malamut is showing a Porsche.
Peter Harrison
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1970 1600 (Stock) - As Yet Unnamed
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Re: NO japanese entries for San Marino Concours.

Post by bakerjf » Tue Apr 23, 2019 4:47 pm

mraitch wrote:
Tue Apr 23, 2019 12:52 pm
Malamut is showing a Porsche.
One year too late it appears.
J. Baker
Cupertino, CA
'69 2000 (Solex)

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Re: NO japanese entries for San Marino Concours.

Post by motorman7 » Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:27 pm

I am on the fence right now about registering a car for the show. I have attended this show for the last four years and enjoy the venue. There is lots of space, a great atmosphere, and I like that the cars can park on the grass. I think my roadster took second place about 3 years ago, but I hate to bring the same car twice to the same show (John should have taken first but he was just there for display that year). I figure that the people attending do not want to see the same cars every year.

I am currently working on a 1973 240Z that is a complete restoration, but not sure it will be done in time for the show. If i can make some good progress on the car this weekend, I may enter.

I partially agree with John's take on the show, however, my opinion is that as long as the best cars place, I am good with the results.

The problem I have with most car shows is that unless it is a Japanese show, like the JCCS, the judges typically have no clue when they are judging Japanese cars. The Concours level shows are included in this mix. When I first started attending car shows with my 1970 240Z about 10 years ago, an old car show sage told me to not get too worked up about the winning cars as the the judges typically have no idea what a stock Japanese car is supposed to look like. He said "you can tell the judges that the Z cars came stock with V-8 engines and blacked out engine bays" and they would believe you. I was a bit skeptical when he said this, but he has been proven right time and time again. Last years San Marino show was a perfect case in point. The winning car in the Japanese class was a 240Z that was painted 'Bada-Bing' silver (silver with a purple haze), blacked out engine bay, chromed engine parts, aftermarket exhaust manifold, just to name a few of the non-stock items . . I was really taken aback. I am guessing that the Benz and Corvette judges wouldn't tolerate such extensive modifications, however, in the Japanese class this is readily acceptable. I pretty much vowed not to return to the show after that, but perhaps I have softened with the passing of a year. Although, more than anything, I would just like to show off the new car.

Anyway, just my opinion.
Rich

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Re: NO japanese entries for San Marino Concours.

Post by bakerjf » Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:53 pm

motorman7 wrote:
Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:27 pm
Last years San Marino show was a perfect case in point. The winning car in the Japanese class was a 240Z that was painted 'Bada-Bing' silver (silver with a purple haze), blacked out engine bay, chromed engine parts, aftermarket exhaust manifold, just to name a few of the non-stock items . .
So glad I missed that, my head would have literally exploded. It is a major PIA to try to put a car in a completely stock configuration. Concours are meant to reward that devotion. To be passed over for what is essentially a restomod?! In addition to recognizing non-collectible ‘85 Celicas, small wonder the class can’t attract anyone anymore.

They need to punt this year, hit the reset button, and IMO find someone that knows what they’re doing to organize/run the class.
J. Baker
Cupertino, CA
'69 2000 (Solex)

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Re: NO japanese entries for San Marino Concours.

Post by mraitch » Thu Apr 25, 2019 10:13 pm

So,

Just spoke to Aaron Weiss

J-class is out this year due to only one entry.

What about 2020

I have been invited to be present in September to discuss future 'classes' for 2020. I am new to this, and I welcome feedback. I think ;85 is too late, my preference would be '75 or earlier. Apart from La Jolla, San Marino would seem to be a good place for J-class. I realize that I only know roadsters but this is an opportunity for many cars.

I request your thoughts as to what you would like to see, What shoukd be the cutoff, what condition etc.

I would love to see all versions, but what criteria>

Your comments to create 2020 as a true expressio of J-Tin.
Peter Harrison
1970 1600 (Stroker) - TOAD SAN (Eliza)
1970 1600 (Stock) - As Yet Unnamed
Lake Balboa (SFV) , California

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Re: NO japanese entries for San Marino Concours.

Post by spl310 » Fri Apr 26, 2019 7:54 am

Most events here use 73 as the cut off. I think that is generally recognized as the end of the muscle car era.
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Re: NO japanese entries for San Marino Concours.

Post by theunz » Fri Apr 26, 2019 8:59 am

I've always considered the end of "chrome bumpers" with the advent of impact bumpers as the end of an era. So it looks like I agree with Sid, just a different criteria.
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Re: NO japanese entries for San Marino Concours.

Post by greydog » Fri Apr 26, 2019 10:16 am

I think that to have a good contest (Concours or other), you need to establish the criteria the judges will use and encourage them to adhere strictly.
For example, will anything other than stock wheels be permitted? If so, must they be as installed by the dealer? I'n not sure about Roadsters but 240's Z's could be had with a variety of mag wheels, vinyl tops, stripes, pinstriping, louvers, g nose, etc all dealer installed options. Would you require that any departure from factory spec be documented as "original"?
Will a survivor car be judged by the same rules in the same class as a restoration?
Here's an example-Spriso has been posting about a beautiful Thunder Black 67.5 2 liter car they pulled from a shed.
The car will be totally redone and, as are his projects, flawless. Will you decide that, as representative of the marque, it had more merit left as it was (ala Wayne Carini) after all, "they're only original once" or that the restoration actually adds merit to the car.
RULES and a clear understanding will, at least, permit people to show their cars with an expectation of equality.
Decide what class or classes you will offer, do your research as to how those classes are judged elsewhere and either adopt someone elses system of devise one of your own.
And, don't let anyone close to a potential competitor be associated with the rules or judging.
Dan
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