More electric problems...

Jorge022770 · Post by **Jorge022770** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 5:54 pm

This has been my biggest challenge since since the day I rolled my car down off the flatbed 18 months ago....

As some of you recall, I had several postings regarding my electrical where the battery was discharging (and some suggested a draw, others the volt. regulator) and then the ammeter was showing overcharge (voltage regulator was slightly tweaked), then it was indicating undercharging which was rectifying when the RPMs were increased......

So today I got a new voltage regulator (the Autozone one from the parts interchange list), charged my 2 month old battery, and put it all in place. WHen I cranked the engine, it started easily, and as soon as it strted, the ammeter fairly quickly went almost all the way to the +++ side. I shut the engine immediately, disconneted the battery, closed the hood, and dragged my frustrated behind to the computer.

DO you recognize this as an alternator's problem? any other problem?

Jorge

hport · Post by **hport** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 9:39 pm

Do you have a stock alternator?
Are any of the regulator wires melted together in the harness somewhere ( from short or header heat if it is on the left side )?
Is the new regulator electronic or the old contact style ?
The alternator will only putout what the regulator will allow, unless there is a short in the wiring, regulator or brush set.

A few things to ponder
Happy hunting
JC

Jorge022770 · Post by **Jorge022770** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 1:41 pm

JC:

I do have the stock alternator. The regulator is the Wells brand that is listed here as a replacement (from "Parts Interchange List" section). The wires, I chacked them and seem fine, but I guess I should just take the alt. out and get it tested.........I'll kept u posted.

Thanks for your help.

Jorge

eastmedia · Post by **eastmedia** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 1:52 pm

Jorge,

When you say you shut off the engine immediately, how soon was that?
When I first put in my new regulator it also read on the HIGH + plus side for a few seconds (maybe 15) but then gradually went down to just above the middle where it stays now. The regulator is actually a variable mechanism that constantly adjusts.

Ron

Jorge022770 · Post by **Jorge022770** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 1:55 pm

Ron:
I don't think I let the engine run for more than 10 seconds...I got worried thtat something was going to blow up!

Jorge

eastmedia · Post by **eastmedia** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 2:09 pm

I ran overcharging for a week or so and the only consequence was that my battery was sizzling after driving for about 20 minutes. A minute or so to diagnose should be OK.

Disclaimer- I am not a professional mechanic. Work at your own risk. If you see or smell anything shut it down and disconnect!

Ron

Jorge022770 · Post by **Jorge022770** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 6:36 pm

Hey Ron....very good "disclaimer"....hahaha. But , at my own risk of course, I started the engine and waited....after about 15 secs like you said, the ammeter started to move towards the center, but it stayed at what I would describe like this:
if you split in three (1/3 +1/3 + 1/3=3/3)the distance from the center to fully + , it stayed in the 1/3closer to the center.

WHen I turn on the headlights, it went to the center. But everytime I would increase the RPMs to 2000rpm, the ammeter would move 1/3 distance again towards +.

All this I did in about 5 mins. whichi dont know if it's enough time to "break-in" the regulator....

so, whats the veredict?

Jorge

eastmedia · Post by **eastmedia** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 7:04 pm

Where is the ammeter when the engine is off? In the center? Did you measure the battery voltage when off?

hport · Post by **hport** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 7:50 pm

Sounds like you have a good working charging system with a battery that may not be taking a full charge, therefore it will keep asking for a charge.
Have the battery tested like you said. Also have the charging system tested as well. You may have a weak amp gauge ( its rare, but hey you never know) 1/3 past center is only 10 amps give or take a few. Not enough to do damage to a modern battery.

JC

Jorge022770 · Post by **Jorge022770** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 8:31 pm

Ron & JC:

The battery is actually a little over two months old. It was drained by whatever problem is there in the electrical, so I took it yesterday to get tested and recharged...it charged completely and all cell are perfect.

Ron: the ammeter is in the middle when I connect everything with the key off the switch. So do you think the alternator is ok and shouldn't have any major problem?

Jorge

datsunrides · Post by **datsunrides** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 7:02 am

This would seem to be ok. When you first start your engine, the starter pulls a fairly large amp load. The alternator will immediately want to recharge the battery. Since the draw was only short term, after a few seconds the regulator will cut back the charge rate, hence the lower reading on the amp gauge. Turning on your lights at idle will also cause the amp gauge to drop due to increased load. When you rev the engine up, it will show the alternator making up the difference for the lights being on. Most old alternators do not charge very well at idle, they only start putting out amps at higher rpm's (about 1200-1500). If you turn your lights on at night while at idle, if you rev the engine, the lights should get slightly brighter. Even though the battery was recently recharged, your amp readings may still be high for a short period while the battery fully recharges. As a final note, the amp swings you are seeing are telling you your regulator is doing its job. If amp readings stay higher that you think is normal, be sure to have the alt diodes checked as everything else seems in order. Good luck!

ganderson · Post by **ganderson** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 9:38 am

Jorge,

I am sure that you have checked it.But, I will mention anyway.How's the condition of the grounding area and wire located on the regulator it's self?

I had major problems because corrosion happened on the washer and on the eyelet of the grounding wire and the the corrosion even continued up the sleeve of my grounding wire.

Once I discovered that and cleaned and scrubbed new surfaces NO ISSUES....

Goodluck,you'll find it.

gene

Post by **ppeters914** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 11:25 am

Yes, proper grounding cannot be overemphasized. I found all of mine were missing!

Now I have,
- starter to frame: braided steel strap
- engine to frame: braided steel strap
- alternator to frame: 4 gauge copper wire
- negative battery cable to frame: 2 gauge copper wire

Before, the car would take a bit before starting. Now, it barely spins before firing right up. Of course, new plugs, plug wires, MSD Blaster coil and Gary Boone EI dizzy might have helped, too.

Still need to check and clean the lights and accessory grounds plus rewire the mess under the dash.

Anyway, check and clean those grounds!

Jorge022770 · Post by **Jorge022770** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 8:11 pm

Ok, here's what I got from the multimeter:

*with engine and all other electricals off, battery reads = 12.45v

*with engine running @ 1500rpm, lights off (or off as well)
it reads = 13.35v

*with engine idling @ 600rpms, lights off it reads = 12.95v

*with engine idling @ 600rpms, lights on, it first showed = 12.55v and then went up to 12.95 and stayed around there.

SO, what do you think?

Jorge

eastmedia · Post by **eastmedia** » Thu Sep 01, 2005 8:15 pm

I think it looks fine Jorge.

I just replaced my alternator so I've been doing measurements as well.

Off at battery 12v
Running at battery 13v with and without lights. @2000rpm.

Ron