should i fix my brakes, or just make my horn louder? hmm...

[George H]

The B210 master is metric but the SAE line will thread into it but the thread to thread contact isn't good enough. On hard application the flare nut could just pop out of the master cylinder.

[23yrRebuild]

I finished the brake rebuild, after a lot of frustrating work. i fought stripped brake lines, then leaky brake lines, a seized caliper, and finally we had trouble bleeding the brakes.

Standard stuff, .....the good news:
You had enough wear and tear to demand a complete "system" rebuild......rather than one problem after another, one weekend after another...if you get the drift. Sometimes total repairs of an entire system, CAN be cheaper, faster, and better than patching as you go, in the long run. This seems especially typical for hydraulic related stuff including fuel systems (tank to carbs), and even electrical systems (battery to plugs, battery to starter, etc., etc.,.....IMHO.

[Tomakze]

after seeing the rears, the car is parked until i have time to fix them (this week hopefully). the rear wheel cylinders are somehow in good shape, and look relatively new. they dont leak or anything. i will pull the drums off my 2000 parts car and have them turned. then if the pads are good on it i will just recycle them and put them on the 1600. i plan on doing the 200sx disc brake swap in the near future, so i want to avoid investing in the rear brakes.

I would really like to know if anyone knows anything about the brake bias changing with the B210 master cylinder. also, i believe the brake bias change would be a good thing when i install the 200sx brake swap... any info is appreciated. i want to sort this mess out!!! it is a beautiful day today, and I CAN'T DRIVE MY BABY!!!! this must be remedied!

[DnCrs13]

quick question. Did you leave the pins in the cylinder or not. I am about to put them back together and the one post from bill says to take them out, but do they stay out?

[Tomakze]

I never removed them... at all. I see no reason too. that post confused me as well. everything went just fine, and the brakes do work, so... i say leave them in! plus the other references i had at my disposal said nothing about removing them. i honestly dont even know how they come out. I figured i better just leave it to the factory specs!

[Tomakze]

oh, and the SAE adapter doesnt thread into the cylinder... it goes in a little way and then binds up. the lines thread all of the way in easily, and tighten up nicely... im just confused by this. i think the master cylinder i pulled off the car was a stock one, and the lines look stock... but it almost acts like it has been converted at some point already...???

when i say it threaded all of the way in, i mean it threads in almost the entire length of the bolt, with only a very small clearance from the nut to the cylinder. and it goes the entire length by hand! it looks right. i just dont get it... the only thing that leads me to believe it may be wrong is that it seeps fluid from the connection. i dont mean it leaks, but the line around the connection is damp. I suppose it could just be worn out... I have slammed on my brakes, and the line didnt pop out. it feels very secure in the cylinder.

but anyhow, is the brake bias wrong then? or would the stock proportioning valve fix this? if it is wrong, i plan on getting an adjustable proportioning valve to correct it.

[DnCrs13]

I never removed them... at all. I see no reason too. that post confused me as well. everything went just fine, and the brakes do work, so... i say leave them in! plus the other references i had at my disposal said nothing about removing them. i honestly dont even know how they come out. I figured i better just leave it to the factory specs!

Thanks! Did you put lube on the pins? They seem very tight, like it will be hard to get back together. I am assuming just muscle strength to put back in? Wont be able to work more tonight, hopefully Wednesday.

[Tomakze]

we weren't sure if we should lube the pins so we did anyways. i just put some red lube on my finger and rubbed it on. (this sounds dirty!!!) i dont think it would hurt.

as far as putting it back together, i just grabbed it in my hands and used both my hands to push it back together. worked fine, you just want to make sure it goes on straight in the beginning. i just worked it in until the seal was inside the cylinder and then pushed. it isnt terribly hard. just takes some pressure. post up some pictures! that way i can be jealous of your non-rusty calipers, lol. good luck!

I am looking forward to the arrival of kyle's calipers... then i will probably be doing this all over again. im gonna be a pro! Kyle is a saint for helping me out. thanks again!

[DnCrs13]

I just put some red lube on my finger and rubbed it on. (this sounds dirty!!!) i dont think it would hurt.

That's what she said! LOL

Ok I will go with that then. I started with the caliper that was really kept sticking and it was not bad inside at all. I took some before and after pics. I will definitely post them when I get done. It always surprises me how straight forward these cars are!

That is an awesome deal Kyle is giving you. I love the people on this forum!

Can't wait to get my girl back on the road!

[DnCrs13]

Ok, well I decided to work on the car for some reason and ended up bending the pin in my caliper. I am not sure what to do now. Can these pins be removed and replaced? I am not sure how I would do it. I have no idea what to do. Do I need to replace this whole part? Any thoughts? Please help. Thanks in advance.

[gpdatsun]

Tomakze,

I'm glad that your caliper rebuild went well and had no problems with the pins and re-assembly.

Let me clarify about the pin and what it does. The pin is there for pad retraction as is the cut out on the backside of the brake pad and the nib on the caliper piston. A common race mod is to break out the pin, grind off the nib and some race pads don't even come with a cut out....pad retraction is not an issue. But stopping is, good brakes are essential.

When working properly the car had decent brakes for the time. Large front rotors, 2 1/8" pistons, and large aluminum finned drums at the rear, plus the dual master at '67.5. Good stuff for the day.

DnCrs13,

Ok, sometimes the pins are a pain. My advice is to break out the pin (Grab with pliers and wiggle out of the caliper until the pin base fatigues and breaks) but be very careful not to mar the piston bore. Now it is a snap to assemble. But I'd suggest that you also grind off the nib so the pad is free to "float". This is race prep. I can't speak to how this will work(sound?) on the street, but it will get you out of a bind and your car back on the street with functional brakes.

(As you're local, come on by and I'll fix you up with another caliper body with pin!)

[Tomakze]

If you can figure out how to remove the pin, the pins on my crappy calipers looked good. i could send you a couple in the mail or something! (i could pull them out of the parts car's calipers...) just someone let me know how they come apart.

did you use air to pop them out or did you try to muscle them out? i am guessing you didnt use air, because i dont even know how they could get bent using the air method. it makes it so easy. i tried to just muscle them out first, but it wouldnt budge. i tried the air, and two seconds later it was out.

also, does anyone know if i absolutely have to get a new rebuild kit for the calipers kyle is sending me, or do you think i could re-use my current kit? i realize the potential to rip a seal, but as long as i am careful, i think it will be ok. i would hate to spend another 40 bucks on a rebuild kit when i have a new one with maybe 2 miles on it. i mean, it is just rubber, right?

Dan, eventually we will get this figured out and be back in business! It sure will be rewarding when this nightmare is over, lol!

[DnCrs13]

Bill,
Thanks for your fast response. I sent you an email.

I used air to pop it out. Apparently I am too muscle-y when it came to putting them back in. I thought it was set all around and gave it some good force, only to realize it was not setting correctly into the bore and bent the pin. I tried to straighten out the pin, but just further marred it up.

I don't see why you couldn't reuse the same kit. As long as it is not all gunked up, it should be fine. The dust shields I pulled off actually looked pretty good.

[Tomakze]

I want to start the hunt for the 200sx rear brake swap... the pmwikitech section says it needs to be an 82-83 200sx. I found someone nearby parting out a 81 200sx, will this not work? does it not have rear disc brakes or something? unfortunately, there is very little info on these cars. (i cant imagine why, its the ugliest datsun ever, imo) also, the 84 and up 200sx's are infinitely more common in the scrap yard. it says the 84 200sx has the correct caliper, but the mounting bracket is different. does that mean i could buy those calipers and fabricate a mounting bracket? as bad as my rear brakes are, i figure this would be a good option instead of spending money on the drums. i prefer disc brakes, as i enjoy spirited driving in the mountains.

i also heard the 240z front calipers can be made to fit, which got me wondering if i could do the swap a lot of 240z owners do and use 84-85 300zx ventilated rotors and 4 piston calipers from a toyota 4-runner. that plus rear discs should make the datto stop like it hit a wall, and keep the dreaded brake fade from happening (i noticed brake fade alarmingly quickly with the stock brakes...) I also understand the stock brakes work fine, blah, blah. I want upgraded brakes, as it sounds like a fun project and also for the "cool!" factor. plus, i see a real benefit to using a ventilated disc over the stock solid ones...

then all this research on brake conversions got me thinking... since the intake will be on the passenger side after swapping the KA motor in, the drivers side will have significantly more clearance... i am wondering if i can use a power brake booster to assist with all these gigantic brakes! (using a 280zx booster and master cylinder. i realize i will probably need to clearance the firewall.) here is my "wet dream" A '68 roadster with 4 wheel disc brakes, 4 piston calipers in the front and ventilated rotors (cross drilled and slotted of course) with power assist brakes... talk about a resto mod! i dunno, maybe it is just a pipe dream.

[ppeters914]

If/when you pursue either of those options, please start new, separate threads so the information doesn't get buried in this thread.