Datsun Roadster Forum-311s.org

Hey, can anyone tell me the part number for the factory installed luggage rack shown on that Roadster? Also, what are those fog lights? They are not everwings that I can tell. Hey, there is a Roadster club sticker in the quarter window - can anyone identify it?

I think that I would trust Phill Brook rather than some entertainment company or the manufacturer of toys as he got his information directly from Nissan in many cases . I don't know what a CTG 110R is, but the Zs have been documented to death - even a non-Z enthusiast can find all of the info that they want on them with a short search. The museum also has a tremendous number of competition cars in their collection. Were they straight off the showroom floor? Of course not.

You are welcome to doubt the veracity of Phill or of anything that I may post. If you are going to use the museum as the definitive answer on things, then the Roadster world needs to reevaluate based on that car in their collection. (Oh, I guess Nissan forgot to install the rear bumper fillers on the 68 cars but the hole shows on that car. None of the 68's that I have owned had that hole...)

UPDATE! I looked at the 68 2000 that they have in that collection. It has California plates! Who knew that Nissan was in bed with the Cali DMV?? They also painted the horns and radiator supports body color on that one, gave it a 69 rear marker light and lo and behold - a pimpster interior!! Red velour!! Dang, could Dave Brisco have disposed of a super rare option?? Take a look!!

http://press.nissan-global.com/COMMON/H ... l.html?217

DatsunBucky wrote:
"Some" ... not "All." Sure, the car in the picture looks nice, but is not necessarily actually representative of what came off the assembly line.

That was my point. The original poster was using that site as proof of the way a car came from the factory. I was pointing out the site was not good proof per the issues of the other cars. If they have a repainted Roadster, they could have a repainted Silvia. I do know the 1966 brochure I have shows 1 color, silvia gold (paint code 545)

Cool, I DID have a factory interior!!


this looks rather official...Motor show?

Sid wrote:

UPDATE! I looked at the 68 2000 that they have in that collection. It has California plates! Who knew that Nissan was in bed with the Cali DMV?? They also painted the horns and radiator supports body color on that one, gave it a 69 rear marker light and lo and behold - a pimpster interior!! Red velour!! Dang, could Dave Brisco have disposed of a super rare option?? Take a look!!

Ok, easy now Sid. Nissan's collection at Zama is NOT a collection of fresh-off-the-showroom-floor cars, though there are examples of cars with very low mileage on them. I had the good fortune to visit the collection at Zama in 2002 and it truly is a treasure trove of cars.

The red 2000 in their collection was donated by the owner of Miller Nissan which was one of the first Datsun dealerships in the USA (at the time it was still wearing plastic license plate frames!) When I saw the car it showed that it had been well-used, but loved.

There are several US-spec cars that have been donated to Nissan's collection at Zama. Likewise, many of the other cars that are there have been donated by their owners when they no longer could care for them.

The CSP311 in their collection is a repaint, but I don't know if white was the original color or not. I too have read that the only color that they came in was the green-gold, but I have seen plenty of examples of white ones in Japan over the years.







Anyway, a warm welcome to Ian! Let us know your parts needs as I come across Silvia parts from time to time... (BTW, I want to check out your car next time I am in England! My family is from Bournemouth!)

Michael Spreadbury

Dave wrote:

this looks rather official...Motor show?

Dave,

I believe the Silvia that you posted a photo of is from the Toyota museum in Tokyo, they have quite a few prominent Datsuns on display in their collection...

Michael

Where are my manners. Ian, please accept my apology for not welcoming you to the forum before going off on a tangent.

Michael, I was being sarcastic in response to Mr. Camouflage's post where he immediately began casting dispersions on Phill Brook's book. I am envious that you have been to see the collection, it does indeed look great. I was merely pointing out that some of the cars there were clearly not production line pulls.

Micheal (swapper) more than welcome to have a look when you are over.

Rapper, no need to appolgize, a lot of threads go off tangent..... like this one on original colour.... but this is where we need to get things documented, just like others have on roadster related points

Spent a bit of time looking at the engine bay, engine, and the parts, so get more of a feel of what needs doing....everything! e.g I have most of the interior trim, for template purposes, but that may not even fit, as all the parts I have are from different Silvia's. I am looking forward to getting started, but not for a while yet.

I will keep you updated...feel free to ask and I will I can answer. I post some more pics soon.....

Cheers
Ian

Hi Ian, sorry for the controversy I have caused. It seems people are happy to mindlessly believe what is published in a book, than to research the facts for themselves. It wasn't that long ago that everybody believed the 240Z was designed by a German. I'm still trying to get to the bottom of the colour issue. So far I have one unsubstantiated claim that they only came in green (same source claims Goertz designed the car, and anyone that knows anything about the CSP311 knows that is an exaggeration, and fails to mention the name of the Japanese Designer that originally penned the design).

Various other evidence I have that indicates they they came in green, gold and white. Though I now have a Japanese speaking colleague who may be able to contact sources in Japan directly to gain further information for me. The Silvia brochure fails to mention anything at all about the colour(s) the car was available in. I could be wrong about the colours, but thats what doing research is all about.

I'll keep in contact with you via email, Ian. This thread reminded me why I don't visit this forum very often anymore. Used to be such nice, well mannered people here before.

spl310 wrote:I think that I would trust Phill Brook rather than some entertainment company or the manufacturer of toys as he got his information directly from Nissan in many cases . I don't know what a CTG 110R is, but the Zs have been documented to death - even a non-Z enthusiast can find all of the info that they want on them with a short search. The museum also has a tremendous number of competition cars in their collection. Were they straight off the showroom floor? Of course not.

You are welcome to doubt the veracity of Phil or of anything that I may post.

Where do you think Sony and Ebbro got there information from? The back of a cereal box?

Some of these cars are restored to original condition cars that are displayed in Nissans Head office. When they are not there, they are returned to Zama for storage. In particular the Silvia, a 240ZG, Z432 and some old GT-R and prince Skylines. Other cars in the collection are well used restored cars that are in the same condition they were in when added to the collection. I don't believe they display the cars that you are finding faults with in their head office, since they are obviously not prime examples. There's even a C210 that was driven around Australian then donated to the collection.

So you are saying:

Nissan somehow messed up and repainted the car white instead of green.

Sony screwed up when they had 3 colours available for the car in Gran Turismo 4.

Ebbro screwed up by producing white and gold scale models.

Nissan screwed up when they released press photos of a Gold Silvia, and Brian Long screwed up when he reprinted the photograph of the gold silvia in his book "Datsun Fairlady Roadster to 280ZX".

But Phill Brook (An Aussie, who wrote a book about a Japanese car that was popular in the USA), is right. Does he happen to mention who designed the car? or his source of information about the Silvia? Honestly, I've never read his book, so I can't comment on the accuracy or inaccuracy of his information about the CSP311, but my research is leading me to believe that it's not correct.

spl310 wrote: The museum also has a tremendous number of competition cars in their collection. Were they straight off the showroom floor? Of course not.

No, most of them were put into storage "as is" when they were retired.

spl310 wrote: I don't know what a CTG 110R is

Really? I guess you don't know everything then do you.

P.S. My car was green, as I believe most, if not all Silvias that came to Australia were.

Mr. Camouflage

I have NEVER said that I know everything. I also have not come on the list casting dispersions on Phill Brooks and his research (especially while having not read his book). The color for the Silvia is listed as 545 - Silvia Gold. It is a metallic gold that has a green tint. I make no claims to be an expert, and I am sure that you have seen way more Silvias than I ever will. You came on and stated that the absolute proof of the color variances is that Nissan owns a white Silvia. You infer that they restored the car. Did they? I don't know. When you posted that as the absolute proof, I went and poked around and saw some obvious deviations from standard on the Roadsters that they have in their inventory. They are certainly nice cars and well worthy of being displayed at the headquarters in my opinion, but they are not as produced.

If you look at the Silvia brochures, you can find photos that appear to be silver. No one yet has mentioned that silver may be an option yet there were a couple of shades of silver available on other Datsun models during the same time period. What I do know about paints from that era is that they were not as stable as paints currently available. Colors faded and looked different after a while. Filters on cameras could also change the colors of the cars in brochures.

Again, I would not take a toy manufacturer's example as gospel. On their roadster models (which are exceptionally nice by the way), they got the shape of the rear panel wrong - they have the shape of the panel used on the high windshield cars. They also have the upholstery pattern from a high windshield car rather than from a 67.5 model which they sought to replicate. The LHD cars are modeled with the license lights on the body which would only be on 69 and 70 models as delivered from Nissan. Based on those inconsistencies, yes, I can easily believe that Ebbro picked colors based on photos they have seen and therefore got it wrong. On the game, well, I have seen cars on many games that had all kinds of things that were not as delivered, so the same holds true there.

I suggest that before you trash Phill's book without having read it, you pick up a copy and check it out. Phill does mention that Goertz was involved, but that the designer of the Silvia is listed as... Wait, I don't want to spoil the ending for you. I will let you research that one.

If you want to check what I am saying about the colors and how photography can change the look, go to the Silvia pages of http://www.fairlady.org and you will see that the Silvia appears white, silver, and Silvia Gold with the same models wearing the same clothing. Knowing that Nissan was not prone to having excessive photo shoots (based on their photo editing of Roadsters for brochures rather than just taking photos of the new models), I firmly believe that these photos are in fact of the same car in the same photo shoot.

Phill did make an error in his book regarding the Silvia. He stated that none were sold in the USA, but since his book was published, it has been verified that one in fact was delivered in the US. Phill also stated that the Silvia Patrols were all destroyed as that is what his research showed. The reality is that at least one escaped the crusher and is alive and well in the US. I have ridden in this car on two occasions - once at Watkins Glen and once on the track at Road Atlanta.

(oh, I looked at your website and found out why I did not know what the CTG 110R is. To me that is quite a homely car although I know that many others disagree... )

spl310,

Speaking to Rob (who runs the fairlady.org site) the silver that you mentioned and see on his website, maybe a metallic purple, as a car this colour was used for the New York Motor show. Perhaps the images Nissan used, as you say, don't quite show the colour as it should....is infact a light purple.....?

Moderators....)and anybody else, what about a Silvia thread, so some facts can be laid down?

Sure, we will be glad to add a Silvia place holder. Will do it right now. Done and copied all of this thread into it. Enjoy!!!

Steve