So The Saga Begins

[DatsunBucky]

Whew! I did the "vehicle shuffle" and the Roadster is now in the barn (as I like to call it). I spent over five hours yesterday replacing the rear springs with the factory comp units. I think I see now why racers go with 3- or 4-link set-ups. Those rear springs weigh a ton!

One thing that took some extra time was that every nut and bolt that came off got the threads chased. Just in case. Another problem turned out to be the rubber spacer/isolators between the springs and the plates the U-bolts go through. I ended up trimming a bit off the corner of each so I could get the U-bolts back in. When I got done, I had one nut left over (the car, not me). And a missing thread chaser. Yup. Suffice it to say that Craftsman thread chasers will take a lot of torque.

To anyone contemplating doing this by themself in the future, don't try to do it one side at a time. I wanted to, so I would have something to compare to on the "not-yet-done" side. After fighting with the rear end not fitting back over the steel plate for a while, I stepped back and took a long look at the situation. The rear end was cocked side to side and wouldn't go back down against the spring. Even jacking up the other side didn't raise the 3rd member enough to line things up. All it did was lift the frame off the jackstands.

I undid the u-bolts on the other side and jacked up the axle. Presto, problem solved. I got started on the rear sway bar, and decided it had already been a long enough day.

As a side note, anyone have any experiences with shox.com? Inquiring minds want to know...

More to follow.

[Guest]

Good stuff Bucky! Why do you need a rear sway bar with the comp leaf springs?

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[DatsunBucky]

alving- it's simple - OVERSTEER! Oversteer (unless it's severe) is your friend on an autocross course. The rear's only a 5/8" bar, and helps counteract a heavier-than-stock one up front (to be installed). Don't forget, this will not be a street car, although I haven't done anything to it yet that can't be un-done. Won't have to insure it, get it inspected and registered if it won't roll on public roads. I found it would cost about the same to make a nice street car out of it as it's going to cost to make it a fast car. It would have taken a total new interior, new seats, top, etc, etc. There would also have been a sh*t-load of fasteners, nuts and bolts etc to replace, and I felt the whole experience would have been a "nickle & dime" situation. So now I get to run real racing slicks...

Besides, at the last autoX up here, STS beat E Prepared!:oops: Not when I get done, they won't.

And this will be basically the same suspension set-up I ran when I had my original Roadster. The front springs are Datsun Sports items rather than the factory ones, and the rear bar attaches differently than the first one. I ran factory shocks before, but they're NLA now.

Maybe some time in the future I'll be able to get a streetable Roadster, but one step at a time...

some pictures:

http://www.users.qwest.net/~buckymac/susp.html

[SLOroadster]

TRUST ME you will have more oversteer than you could possibly need. I have been there and done that. I have the rear swaybar, and I took it off. The car is faster without it.

Will

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[S Allen]

I ran without one no problems. I have the competition springs with the adjustable Koni shocks on the rear end. The only other thing I may do some day is get the rearend gears welded/locked. I think in auto-cross you are making tighter turns than in a road race. Thunderhill has some pretty tight turns but I never had the rear end break loose on me. I could floor it through the front straight and take turn 1 at full tilt when you hit the apex just right. Darn, I miss doing that. Maybe next year!


Steve

[oilleak]

The consensus I've gathered is that the rear bar makes the car oversteer too much - and with the comp springs, that'll be even more. That however is running under street prepared rules. In EP or EM, you might be able to do enough to the suspension that it'll work well. Remember in those classes you can run slicks. What I can say for sure it this, you don't need the rear bar if you have stock rear fenders - the car will rotate just fine with any rubber you can fit in there. If you're going to be fast in CSP or any faster class - EP, EM - you need to cut the rear fenders up to fit more tire. Andy Cost is running his car in EP and put the japco fenders on it. I'd probabley be thinking about 12 inch wide slicks. The Hoosiers I run are 10 inches in section width.
Bill Harvey thought that you might have some success making a smaller rear bar - 1/2 inch or even less - but he tried the 5/8ths bar once and took it off imediately. I'm going to the 66 springs on my car which are slightly stiffer and slightly lower but not so much so as the comp springs (Yeah Steve, I haven't gotten around to putting them on YET).

[DatsunBucky]

Thanks for the input, guys. It's been noted, but being the stubborn person I am, I'll try it my way and see. As it is right now, I'd rather deal with oversteer than scrub off speed with the front tires. I hope my reactions can be honed to be as quick as they were before.

Front springs are next. Anything tips or hints for me?

Also, anyone know if the vendors have stuff like return springs for the rear brakes? Or if the 510 rear drum pieces are the same as ours? I found a broken spring. When I took the drum off, all the parts fell out on the floor. Literally. Good thing brakes are next after suspension.

[oilleak]

Springs are easy to do. I've pulled them out by seperating the ball joint from the upper A arm and by unbolting the lower A arm from the frame. If all I am doing is changing the springs, I think unbolting the lower arm from the frame is quicker and easier.
The one tip I'll give you is to have the tires you plan on running mounted to check clearances through all of the suspension and steering motion. The alignment will make a difference! My Hoosiers (225/50-14) didn't clear on the left side. I had to realign it to get clearance. The caster can be altered enough to give over a 1/4 fore/aft movement of the upper ball joint. I wound up having to put a lot of shims on the rear of the upper A arm pivot to get clearance and the camber I wanted. Ended up with -2.5 degrees camber and some huge amount of + caster, it's like driving a nautilus machine at parking lot speeds. Also, check the bump stop height as if you cut it too much, you can wind up with contact between the frame and the steering rod.

[DatsunBucky]

Yeah, I'm only doing the springs. They're the Datsun Sports fronts that quite a few of the people here have used. Nothing even close to radical. I had -1 degree camber with toe and caster stock last time. Will probably go for -2 degrees this time.

Sure glad I have an impact wrench...