SR20 Questions??

buzzardmountain · Post by **buzzardmountain** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 11:11 am

Okay, forgive me, but I'm sooooooo confused with the replies. I don't know who's asking, answering, or even if this is where I'm suppose to post this.

The pic that Micheal posted of the optional frame modification for the alternator, is that the only necessary cutting necessary for the SR20 to fit?

Again, I hope this ? is in the right thread.

spriso · Post by **spriso** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 11:24 am

is that the only necessary cutting necessary for the SR20 to fit?

No, there are several more cuts that need to be done to get the engine to fit the chassis.

I will be outlining all of them in detail on the Hybrid-How-To thread as I have time. The intention is that you should have a detailed look at every frame modification that needs to be done to the frame to get the SR engine to fit.

Just a quick outline of what needs to be cut and modified:

Front Crossmember
Notch the X member for a transmission mount
Build two new motor mounts
Modify the exhaust holes to accomidate larger exhaust
Alternator notch (optional)
New radiator mounts (optional)

I even do a few other little modifications to the frame as well, such as adding tabs to hold the fuel tank (so it is not hanging off of the trunk floor), and grounding studs for the wiring harness.

All of this will be detailed in the Hybrid-How-To sticky! Just be patient!

Michael
spriso.motorsports

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 12:48 pm

Okay, forgive me, but I'm sooooooo confused with the replies. I don't know who's asking, answering, or even if this is where I'm suppose to post this.

Steve simply cut and pasted all those back and forth "discussions" from Michael's "SR20DE How to" thread and dropped them in here, thus decluttering the original thread.

The idea is this: Michael is going to swap an SR20DE into a roadster and fully document each step of the process for us. Since that thread was getting cluttered up fast with either non technical issues or questions that didn't really pertain to the process of doing the install, Steve created this thread as a place to get all your SR questions answered.

If in doubt, ask the question here. It will either get answered here or you'll find out that it's going to be detailed in the write-up shortly.

DELETED · Post by **DELETED** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 2:30 pm

DELETED

eVoMotion · Post by **eVoMotion** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 4:45 pm

subscribe

buzzardmountain · Post by **buzzardmountain** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 5:22 pm

spriso wrote:
is that the only necessary cutting necessary for the SR20 to fit?
No, there are several more cuts that need to be done to get the engine to fit the chassis.

I will be outlining all of them in detail on the Hybrid-How-To thread as I have time. The intention is that you should have a detailed look at every frame modification that needs to be done to the frame to get the SR engine to fit.

Just a quick outline of what needs to be cut and modified:

Front Crossmember
Notch the X member for a transmission mount
Build two new motor mounts
Modify the exhaust holes to accomidate larger exhaust
Alternator notch (optional)
New radiator mounts (optional)

I even do a few other little modifications to the frame as well, such as adding tabs to hold the fuel tank (so it is not hanging off of the trunk floor), and grounding studs for the wiring harness.

All of this will be detailed in the Hybrid-How-To sticky! Just be patient!

Michael
spriso.motorsports

Sounds great Michael. Thanks for doing this. I'm sure it'll answer alot of my questions.

Pics are great!

Post by **spl310** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 10:28 pm

buzzardmountain wrote:The pic that Micheal posted of the optional frame modification for the alternator, is that the only necessary cutting necessary for the SR20 to fit?

The last time I posted this info, it resulted in the thread being locked and me being called just about everything but a son of God. But, since you asked, I will hazard to post the info again. You can install the SR20 with NO cuts to the frame. It has been done by Ken Smart in Australia. This is the thread where I mentioned his success:

http://www.311s.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3880

In that thread, it is suggested that the car was only mocked up and not driven. It was suggested that it surely could not work the way that it was installed. Well there is good news. Some time after the thread was locked, I corresponded with Ken and he did confirm that there were no cuts to the frame, and no issue with the engine hitting the frame. He did dimple a portion of the front crossmember about 10mm to give some clearance. There is bad news. The ISP that Ken had the info posted on has gone away.

But, there is more good news! Archive.org has his info! Here is a link:

http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www ... jsr20.html

If you click through the pages, most of the pictures will be available. It appears that the photo showing the front crossmember dimple disappeared, but I have it if you want to see it.

Bottom line: conventional wisdom in the US is that it cannot be done without cutting, but the reality from down under is that it has been done. Ken did tell me that he had to build a cantilevered mount for the transmission (no idea what that looks like). You may have to solve that problem on your own.

I sent an e-mail to Ken asking for more details, but have not heard from him. If there is interest, I will share the knowledge when I hear from him.

Have fun!

spriso · Post by **spriso** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 11:07 pm

Hi Sid,

Ken has been driving his SR20DE powered roadster for 8 years(!), but was still having heating issues sorted to be out. He and I exchanged a few e-mails last summer, and he is still enjoying his car!

Ken Smart's SR powered roadster conversion:

Here is part of the last message that I got from him:

I would like to do a rebuild of the car paint, soft top etc and revisit the SR swap in terms of engine mounts, trannie mount, gauges redo the dash, redo the wiring, do some documentation, rethink the air intake/filter setup and a few other things.

Sounds like some of his original modifications need to be re-done... not unusual, his car was the first SR converted roadsters ever done!

We must remember, Australia has much stricter rules for cars with conversions that cars in North America (not necessarily a bad thing mind you!) And all cars that have had an engine swap must be inspected by an engineer before they are allowed to go back on the road.

The decision to pound the frame instead of cut it may have been forced by local road licensing regulations rather than making his life any easier.

I can assure you, that engine cannot be any fun to install if the clearances are that tight! And I would be shocked if that engine is not touching the frame somewhere... Plus, and advantages of his higher performance engine have now been choked by exhaust holes that have not been modified through the x-frame.

I will stand by my comments in the other thread... there are lots of SR powered roadsters on the road that will back up my experience.

But as always, I will say, to each their own! I would rather have you driving your SR powered roadster than having it be yet another forgotten dream sitting under a tarp or in the garage. If pounding the crap out of your frame with a 5-pound hammer to get things to fit is your speed, by all means, go for it!

Michael

67 1/2 1600 · Post by **67 1/2 1600** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 1:08 am

When doing a Swap like that is the fuse box needed? I have seen alot of SR swaps in roadsters but I dont remember seeing one with that fuse box...

DELETED · Post by **DELETED** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 5:45 am

DELETED

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 8:13 am

When doing a Swap like that is the fuse box needed? I have seen alot of SR swaps in roadsters but I dont remember seeing one with that fuse box...

No, you don't have to use the OEM Nissan fuse box but you do have the need for additional fuses above and beyond what the stock 311 panel provides. The biggest consumers on the SR that are not on a stock 311 are the electric fan and the electric fuel pump. You also have to fine power for the ECU and the injectors.

The 311 fuse panel is strapped as it is. Cutting and splicing into it to feed the extra stuff is not the best idea. You're better off running a second panel, in addition to the 311 one. Or, ditch the stock 311 panel and run a single, slightly larger, panel that can handle everything.

DELETED · Post by **DELETED** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 9:01 am

DELETED

spriso · Post by **spriso** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 9:15 am

Also: is there a difference between RHD and LHD frames?

As far as I have been able to determine, the RHD and LHD frames are the same.

When doing a Swap like that is the fuse box needed?

Every swap we have done has been a little bit different. If the car is an early car, I highly recommend replacing the original harness and rewiring the car with a Painless or EZ wiring harness. The later cars have much better wiring harnesses, so if your harness is in good shape, you may be able to modify it.

Either way, you are still dealing with a 30-yearold harness, and it is very likely that the wires have oxidization issues and failing insulation as well as corroded terminals.

A total re-wire is a lot of work, but starting with an EZ Wiring harness (or Painless, or any of the other aftermarket hot-rod harnesses) is a great way to make everything work.

On the car that I am converting right now, the harness is in excellent condition, so I will build a sub-harness that uses a partial fuse box and relay rail from a S13 240SX to power the ECU, fuel pump, and electric fans.

All of this will be documented in the Hybrid How-To thread.

Michael

buzzardmountain · Post by **buzzardmountain** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 9:06 am

spl310 wrote:
buzzardmountain wrote:The pic that Micheal posted of the optional frame modification for the alternator, is that the only necessary cutting necessary for the SR20 to fit?
The last time I posted this info, it resulted in the thread being locked and me being called just about everything but a son of God. But, since you asked, I will hazard to post the info again. You can install the SR20 with NO cuts to the frame. It has been done by Ken Smart in Australia. This is the thread where I mentioned his success:

http://www.311s.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3880

In that thread, it is suggested that the car was only mocked up and not driven. It was suggested that it surely could not work the way that it was installed. Well there is good news. Some time after the thread was locked, I corresponded with Ken and he did confirm that there were no cuts to the frame, and no issue with the engine hitting the frame. He did dimple a portion of the front crossmember about 10mm to give some clearance. There is bad news. The ISP that Ken had the info posted on has gone away.

But, there is more good news! Archive.org has his info! Here is a link:

http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www ... jsr20.html

If you click through the pages, most of the pictures will be available. It appears that the photo showing the front crossmember dimple disappeared, but I have it if you want to see it.

Bottom line: conventional wisdom in the US is that it cannot be done without cutting, but the reality from down under is that it has been done. Ken did tell me that he had to build a cantilevered mount for the transmission (no idea what that looks like). You may have to solve that problem on your own.

I sent an e-mail to Ken asking for more details, but have not heard from him. If there is interest, I will share the knowledge when I hear from him.

Have fun!

Thanks for the post spl310. I'd seen that thread, but alas couldn't make out much with all the e-fighting. It took me some time to figure out DELETED was some guy named Alvin who seemed to be active here and asked to have his posts deleted. Which made all these threads hard to read for a newbie like myself. This board is just about as bad as my 350z site for flaming.<-----Just kidding, don't want to put on the flame-suit.

I hope these threads can remain positive.

Post by **spl310** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 9:33 am

Happy to help! If you have a tough time with the archive.org link, let me know and I will see if I can get you to what you want to see. I have sent an e-mail to Ken regarding updates, but have not as of yet heard back.