Greg’s ‘69 SRL311-07324

[david premo]

Hey Greg, I would say the needle in the top picture looks correct and the bottom one would make it run very rich.
Dave

[Stick]

Hey Greg, I would say the needle in the top picture looks correct and the bottom one would make it run very rich.
Dave

Thanks, Dave… that’s the way I reinstalled them and after rechecking it’s still showing signs of being a touch rich. I adjusted the mixture dial about 1/4 turn counterclockwise to lean it up a little more and I’ll check it again tomorrow.

[Gregs672000]

Very strange that the plugs were like that. I don't think that's possible for the CARBS to be doing and must be being caused by something else (the carb itself cannot send more fuel down one runner than the other)... intake leak on 1 and 4; spark issues in 2 and 3; valve lash/vacuum differences (checked out fine? ); temperature differences? I'd be curious what the compression looks like... those plugs may be telling you something, what I'm not sure yet.

Install a new set of plugs... those will take forever to clear and be readable, even if you soak them in (most) cleaners and won't give you any useful information for tuning. They will also tell you if the plug mystery continues.

[Stick]

I was thinking the same thing. One would think that if a set is being fed by the same carb and intake the plugs would be similar.
I'm starting to suspect some temp issues ... I currently don't have a heat shield installed ... for whatever reason, when the carbs were replaced, it was done without a heat shield. Most of my trips are fairly short in nature and the temp gauge is reading in a very normal spot (consistently and steady). That said, the exhaust temps can be pretty high and it sits right below the carbs.

New Vacuum routing.jpg

Thinking back it ran great for the 12-15 miles and the problem didn't start until I pulled in the parking lot and stopped to let my wife out. Very little air being pulled through the engine bay and maybe exhaust was heating the fuel up pretty quickly (boiling)?

I'll grab a couple new sets of plugs and a heat shield since it should probably have one anyway

[Stick]

Quick update:
Spent quite a bit of time today going through things with Dave Premo over the phone.... learned a lot and connected a lot of the what with the why and How.
Dave - Thanks again for all of your time today and sharing the knowledge - Super helpful and appreciated!

I'm pretty sure that the issues I am having are related to the exhaust heating up the fuel and boiling it when the engine gets hot and sits at an idle without the heat shield ... without the air moving through the engine bay while driving it will start to exhibit the issues. I took some under-hood temps with things warmed up and idling and it's pretty hot, even when the hood is open and heat can easily escape.

Made some minor adjustments to the valve lash again today, double checked timing, and replaced the plugs. I also leaned ups the mixture screws another 1/8 turn and it has the plugs turned to a nicer shade of light brown/tan. The car is running strong.

Also checked the cylinder pressures (with the throttles propped open) and I think they are OK
#1 165. (This one took a little more effort than the rest to get my gauge positioned with the cooling hose in the way!
#2 165
#3 165
#4 175

Ordering the heat shield tomorrow!

[drieseck]

First, I was going to suggest, keep your wife in the car----- seemed when she's -----in all's well, you drop her off and all goes to hell.

Seriously, sounds like your back on the road, congrats, I know the feeling. I do want to reiterate the generosity of Dave Premo's time. He's helped me on several occasions talking through the issue then teaching me what to look for and proper techniques for the best result, based on his vast experience. (Same can be said for Greg672000, JT and a number of other's here). For those of us learning, we're lucky to have all of them.

[Gregs672000]

Yeah, glad you were able to talk to Dave... he knows his stuff and likes to help. Compression looks good, plugs sound much better. It really does help to gain an understanding of what does what and why, and I often suggest that people read through the entire manual just to become familiar with all the cars systems, even if it doesn't all make sense.

Drive it for a while, then check all the plugs again. They are your best window into what's going on in the engine.

[Stick]

First, I was going to suggest, keep your wife in the car----- seemed when she's -----in all's well, you drop her off and all goes to hell.

Seriously, sounds like your back on the road, congrats, I know the feeling. I do want to reiterate the generosity of Dave Premo's time. He's helped me on several occasions talking through the issue then teaching me what to look for and proper techniques for the best result, based on his vast experience. (Same can be said for Greg672000, JT and a number of other's here). For those of us learning, we're lucky to have all of them.

I thought the same thing! Now she's hesitant to go for a ride...

100% - I'm fairly new around here and I can't say enough about the generosity of certain members and the willingness to help out. Dave, Greg (672000), JT, Sid have all been tremendous resources and quick to offer a hand. Reading through the threads it seems like there are many others willing to do the same and agree we're luck to have them.... I certainly couldn't have gotten this far without them and the resources this site has to offer!

[Stick]

Yeah, glad you were able to talk to Dave... he knows his stuff and likes to help. Compression looks good, plugs sound much better. It really does help to gain an understanding of what does what and why, and I often suggest that people read through the entire manual just to become familiar with all the cars systems, even if it doesn't all make sense.

Drive it for a while, then check all the plugs again. They are your best window into what's going on in the engine.

I feel like I'm on the journey of having decent conceptual understanding to more practical experience every day... so much to learn. I don't think I could count how many times I have pulled the plugs for verification that I'm headed the right direction.

Time spent with guys like you has proven invaluable! Thanks again, Greg!

[Gregs672000]

Hi Greg, we are very happy to have you in our family! There has always been something "different" about folks who own these cars, and I agree that it's reflected in the attitude on this site... it is a family (a good, well adjusted family!) and we do care about the people here. I have no time for sites where people get flamed for asking a question or posting an opinion. Our goal is for you and yours to enjoy your car and the fun/adventure/learning they can bring. The format of this site and people like Steve who keep it running makes it fun and easy to use, vs something like Facebook. I use no other social media... I get what I need here!

Now, tell your wife we have your back, that's she's a fearless Roadster co-pilot, and from this point on she is changed for the better! My wife (who cannot drive a manual trans) takes great pride in saying that, while she can't drive the car, she can make peanut butter and jelly sandwiches at 90mph on a back road in the sun... and I greatly appreciate that! She has handed me tools or kept me hydrated any time the car has asked for or needed something on the side of the road, and we have always gotten home. The cars are very reliable once sorted out, and my problems have usually been of my own making.

So, onward with no fear, you're all part of the family now!

[Stick]

So as mentioned in the "What did you do to your roadster today" thread I got the new heat shield and carb springs installed, flushed cooling system and worked on the heater valve and installed some additional heat shielding for the headers .... all of this because on mothers day it started sputtering and died when it was hot and I came to a stop .... convinced it was definitely heat related and boiling the fuel. All of that work should have helped out, right?

IMG_1480.JPG

I went for another ride today (car was running perfect) and stopped by a friend's house for a few minutes to chat .... tried to start it back up and it wouldn't ... Let it sit for 30 minutes with hood up and still wouldn't start. Towed home again frustrated and embarrassed.

Let it fully cool down in the garage and tried to restart it. Nothing, but caught something out of the corner of my eye. The coil was arcing down from the center of the primary. Closer inspection it looked like there was a faint line that looked like a thin crack? Didn't hesitate and ordered a new coil ( I talked with Pertronix the other day about the coil resistance and also being wired through resistor. They said I had the incorrect internal resistance and power shouldn't run to it through a resistor (12V straight to the coil).

IMG_1498.PNG

While looking at the wiring, it seemed a little odd (not fully shocked after the numerous silly things I have found so far) .... from the firewall behind the brake valve I have 4 wires coming through - yellow/white to the temp sensor, yellow/blue to the brake sensor and two black/white striped wires. One went straight to the resistor with 12V ignition power. The second wire had a "Y" splice into it and went to the other end of the resistor (6V at that end of resistor) and the other one went to the positive terminal on the coil (carrying 6V there with ignition on). I unhooked them from the resistor and measured power again. One had 12v and the other nothing.
Both black/white wires ran into the main harness just behind the fuse block. Tried to review the schematic but cannot understand where the black wire with the "Y" to the resistor and coil power ran to .... the only power it had was the 6V that seemed to be present when hooked to the other side of the resistor (nothing when unhooked from resistor. Thinking of capping that one off and running the 12V wire directly to the new coil when it arrives next week.

IMG_1489.JPG

Aside from the direction I got from Pertronix, I'm a bit confused as to whether the bad coil and weak ignition power (6V to the coil) is the cause of hot re-start problems or if it is still possibly a heat related issue.

Sorry to ramble on... Happy Memorial Day to all of our veterans!

[Gregs672000]

So, the Roadster is testing you to see just how dedicated you are eh? Honestly, I am sorry to hear if your continued troubles. Seriously, these ARE reliable cars once sorted out! Unfortunately I can't advise you here as my ignition is no longer like this, but numerous owners use the Petronix and should be able to help. You might also do a site search for Petronix. If you don't get an answer post a new thread as not everyone reads all of them like I do (can't help myself!).

Keep in mind when troubleshooting: An engine needs fuel, spark and compression to run. If it dies, pull the coil wire from the dizzy (or plug wire from a plug), insert an insulated (plastic ended) screw driver in it and have someone crank the engine while you're holding the metal driver close to metal to check for spark... no spark, no go and you will know where to look further.

Good luck, and I'm sure you'll keep us posted!

[Stick]

Thanks, Greg ... I'm pretty clear on what is needed on the Pertronix side after speaking with them, but it's the Roadster wiring that has me a little confused. The car has been running like a rockstar but only when it stops to idle when hot or now, restart when hot, is it causing any trouble. I removed the resistor today in anticipation of the new coil arriving on Wednesday this week. I think that I'm going to "cap off" the black and white wire that was split out and running to the resistor end and then the positive coil side.... It doesn't have any ignition power unless it was running through the resistor (where the other end was getting 12v). I'll take the other Black/white stripe wire that has 12V ignition power and connect that to the Positive side of the new coil and see what happens.

Still trying to determine if the restart issues when hot are related to overheated fuel/carbs or the ignition system. Hoping we're down to the bad coil that was only receiving 6V and has a crack and slight oil leak from the top of the canister. I bought the Epoxy version rather than the oil filled and went with the recommended 3.0 ohm coil vs the 1.5 ohm that I had. Hoping that will sort out a stronger more reliable spark delivery.

[Gregs672000]

I do know there can be vapor lock issues and that sort of thing, but it's not something I've ever experienced as our weather tends to be a bit cooler here in the PNW. If I'm suspecting a fuel delivery issue I will use starter fluid to substitute for gas... a short burst at the air cleaner will typically do the trick. If it doesn't fire on that then you know it's spark. People have often mentioned some kind of fuel line to tank return valve that goes bad, but a '67 didn't have one so I have no experience. Strange that your issues only happen after it's been running, but that could be the coil issues you mentioned. People running stock points sytems have also mentioned worn or frayed wires and connections in the dizzy but I don't know anything about the Petronix. Again, testing for spark and for fuel when it happens will tell us a lot. Keep at it, we'll get it...