Searching in Seattle

[SurlaCraque]

Hello, I'm looking for a father - son project to do with my eldest who is 15 yo and keen on cars. I immediately thought that a 60s roadster would be perfect: small, relatively easy to work on, sporty, and not likely to become a daily driver (we'd rather he use one of our modern cars in the winter months, to go to the mountains, take friends camping etc). Of course the first thing I thought was "MGB". The second thing I thought was Triumph - my parents actually had a TR250 back in the day (imagine if you had one of those now) but I had to spoil that by coming along and necessitating a family car purchase. So we discovered the Datsuns in our research and my son is smitten. I've never been in one but I did wrench on various Toyotas / Hondas / Mazdas back in the day so I appreciate a well made Japanese car.

So we're looking. Missed out on a chance on what looked like a really straight 1969 1600 up in Everett that just needed some mechanical work to get running. The price was right I guess because in between the time I called about it and made plans to see it the next day, it was sold. On that note, I'd much rather deal with mechanical than body issues, but I'm sure I'm not the only one. However I do need a project: that's the whole point with my son, if the car is running well and looks great than what do we have to work on? A couple of fiddly trim items or whatever does not make for enough of a project. If anyone knows of a suitable car nearby I'm all ears. Likewise if someone local is interested in showing us their baby we'd be happy to drop by.

On the subject of body work, ok so say we got a car that needed to be repainted and had some rusty spots on the fenders and maybe a ding or two, what would that cost to be taken care of by a professional shop? In 2021 in the Seattle area. Ballpark. Let's assume we remove the trim etc and we're fine getting it painted the same color or close to what it already is and we don't need to compete at Pebble Beach but don't want to see any orange peal either.

Final question: we're mainly looking at the 1967.5 -70 roadsters, but regarding the earlier 1600s are they pretty much similar to the later ones? Is the 3 main bearing engine noticeably worse / rougher than the later engines? Is it hard to find parts?

TIA - Colin

[Gregs672000]

Welcome Colin and son! I'm itching to respond but I have to run to work. I don't have a car for you but want to help you with your questions... I'll write soon... didn't want you to think we weren't listening! We love new converts and encouraging the next generation.

[D P]

A bit of a drive, but looks clean and usd to cad conversion helps...

https://vancouver.craigslist.org/van/ct ... 75085.html

[SurlaCraque]

Thanks Greg I look forward to hearing from you. DP nice car but where’s the project? That one looks minty.

[Gregs672000]

You bet Colin... I just get excited when I see "father and son project" because I think those things are really important and that car restoration is a great way of learning a whole host of problem solving skills that transfer to life in general. As a life coach I came up with a car restoration/repair program designed to use cars as a real world metaphor for building and/or restoring ones life (unfortunately I couldn't secure enough funding to do it on my own).

Anyway, as you have found the cars are rapidly growing in popularity and can go pretty quickly, so it will pay to be checking every source regularly. These cars are easy to work on and understand, and this 311s family is loaded with information we're all happy to share. To that end, I believe there's a check list of what to look for (in the tech wiki?) when evaluating an unknown car. You mentioned body work, and of course there are different degrees of what that entails. Prepping for paint is a whole lot different than discovering unexpected rust that requires some surgery, so knowing where to look is important. Since you're wanting to become part of the family, other members have at times offered to take a look at a car near them that's a distance from you... it never hurts to ask here. Most of the parts are available with a few exceptions on some of the more obscure engines (I read something about hard to find engine bearings for 1500's?). Sometimes you have to bite the bullet on a part, but other times there are work arounds that will do the job while not being completely "stock" so it again pays to check with us. Our vendors are awesome!

If you have a basic understanding of mechanics you won't likely be in over your head. What's becoming more expensive are things like machine work, but that's for most every car/engine. Body work and paint has also changed and is labor intensive, so the more hours you can put into that the less it will cost. As you said, that is balanced between what you can do and what a professional can do as to the final outcome. Given the parameters you outlined, I think you could do a lot of it yourselves if the car is fairly solid (that's the key). I did several cars over the years that I prepped right to where it was very close to be painted. I used Earl Scheib back in the day, made friends with the crew there and got them a bit excited about the car, and had them shoot an extra coat or two of clear on it so I could wet sand and buff it out... they came out like a $4000 job for $400 bucks (back in the day) and lasted for years. Sanding and buffing can make a huge difference so long as you have enough paint on it. I once had a friend who decided to spray the car we were working on himself, and it came out like spackle. After (a lot) of sanding and buffing it looked like a black mirror. I can't say what it would cost these days, and paint technology (and the cost of materials) has changed a lot, so what I would do now is to find some local independent shops near you and talk with them about what it might cost. You'll also get a feeling about the people there and if they're willing to work with you and care a bit about your car. You can learn to do body work and there is likely info on places like YouTube to guide you. There's also a good number of Roadster owners in your area who may be willing to come by and offer suggestions or guidance. What you probably want to avoid is a car that's more rusty than you realize. The car's body sits on horse hair mats that collect moisture and can rust the top cap of the frame, and now we're talking body off and a lot more work... your kid might be graduating by the time you get it done!

It's important to have a realistic time frame for what you want to achieve and a budget to match (an important part of the learning opportunity... evaluating the situation). Hours sanding bondo/primer teaches perseverance when things kinda suck but also satisfaction when it's finally straight. Roadsters have become more expensive and desirable, parts more scarce and subsequently more expensive, but the cars are really cool and a very different driving experience than a modern car. Check out the vendors sites and start tallying up what it would cost to rebuild an R or U motor, fix or replace brakes, redo interior... that may help in creating a budget if that's a concern, and then increase it by 20%! Knowing these things ahead of time will help you understand the value when someone says "it has all new brakes." Does that include the master cylinder? Can be $$$.

So, keep poking around, ask questions of us and we'll see how we can help. Regardless, good luck on your adventure. As you know, it's more than just the car... it's the project done together, the bonding, the learning, the overcoming of challenges, and the feeling of accomplishment when it's done. Plus you end up with a really cool car that people will stop and talk to you about, all the time. Then you get to share the father/son story and all the good memories for both of you! Win/win!

[RBMann]

I have one you can look at just north of Seattle in Kenmore. Not for sale though. I’ll be back in town after the 25th.

1F8188D5-1530-43BE-8BA3-75D9248EFEA5.jpeg

[todd lorber]

That car in Alberta looks like a great deal=especially if those are Canadian dollars. I understand that its not much of a project, but it will cost WAY more than that to get a car to that condition.

By the way, were those '69 rear sidelights on a '70 typical for Canada, or did someone change them out?

[Gregs672000]

That car in Alberta looks like a great deal=especially if those are Canadian dollars. I understand that its not much of a project, but it will cost WAY more than that to get a car to that condition.

But the project is the point! Some project will show up in the WA/OR/CA area. The best match would be a car where the body is in primer, it needs an engine and interior redo I would think.

[dads311]

Just saw this on Craigslist; https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/cto/ ... 96844.html
Looks like lots of body filler on the driver rear so look underneath for more damage if you go look at it.

[Gregs672000]

There ya go! No doubt you will find rust, but I bet you could do a decent job with it, and the car already has some cool stuff on it... Webers and a 5 speed. Somebody knew this car and Roadsters. See the Z too? I'd call that an instant candidate.

[buenavides1]

Just saw this on Craigslist; https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/cto/ ... 96844.html
Looks like lots of body filler on the driver rear so look underneath for more damage if you go look at it.

I hope that he bought it, this car is not as bad as the other vehicles that they advertise on this website.

[SurlaCraque]

Thanks for comments guys and the encouragement Greg. Another guy messaged me with info about the NW Datsun owners group. Seems like there are quite a few folks around, and meets where you can see cars, although we're rapidly entering the non-roadster time of year. RBMann maybe I'll take you up a tour (and a drive?) in that nice "69.

Regarding that Red 1970 on San Juan I did call the guy about it. Yeah there's definitely a lot of bondo on that left rear fender panel, and he was honest enough to admit that the other side was the same. The paint is pretty tired looking. I'm really leery of body work cuz I know nothing about doing it myself and I've heard horror stories about how far over your head you can get. Also San Juan Island, while a lovely place, is a pain in the ass to get to for this family man just to look at a car that I may not even buy. Frankly the price seems high if the car is going to have to be stripped down and have major body work done, because that won't be done by me and I need to get a handle on how much that would cost. I'm going to try to call around to some shops tomorrow to get a ballpark idea. If any of you local guys have shops to recommend I'm all ears.

I'm still kicking myself about this car I missed in Everett a week or so ago. I hadn't really heard of Datsun roadsters when my son sent me the link to the posting. Looked sharp and the body looked straight and tight. Nice silver paint job and tasteful mag wheels with wider rubber. Talked at length with the owner and he seemed like a straight shooter, he had bought the car from a dealer who bought it from the guy who had fully restored it. Literally no rust. Garage kept. Of course I would have inspected and verified that. The interior has some issues and it wasn't running, but it didn't sound like a major problem, maybe a fuel pump or electrical issue, and he was moving and didn't want to take it with him. $7K. I think the condition must have been as described because it was gone before I could bring my son to meet him the next day, which was only a day or two after the ad was posted. So it's hard to pay $8.5K for a car on San Juan that I know needs significant body work after seeing a listing like that one.

[Gregs672000]

I hear ya, it can be hard to find the right one. My wife and I are looking for a replacement BMW Z3 after her's was just declared a total, and they are getting harder to find especially since she wants another red one. I've been looking at cars as far away as Florida...