Orlando Engine Swap Project

[denniswagnerusa]

I finally got started with my planned engine swap on my 1969 1600. I thought I was ready to remove the engine last weekend but remembered that I had not unfastened the exhaust manifold from the exhaust pipe. Today I rented a engine hoist and removed the engine myself. It was not difficult because the hoist was able to lift the engine high enough to clear the front of the engine compartment without repositioning the chains. I was able to get the hoist back in time to get the 4 hour rate.

While the engine was tilted on the hoist coolant was dripping from the exhaust manifold. I guess the blown head gasket put coolant where it wasn't supposed to be.

The next thing to do is find the bolts holding the body to the frame. I found and removed 2 in the trunk and four in the engine compartment. Before I look for the rest I am going to search this site to find out where they are supposed to be. I am also going to try to find some advice on how to remove the body and how to store it.

[LI Roadster]

so you're going ahead with the SR20?

[notoptoy]

There are several threads on the bolts and a body cradle active right now. The information is here! I'm not far up the road if you want some weekend help!

[Alvin]

what is the plan, to separate frame/body and store it?

[denniswagnerusa]

I don't know for sure which engine I will use to replace the original. I'm looking at the SR20DE mostly because of all the info available about that swap. I'm interested in the KA24DE also, mostly because it seems to have a few fans. I'm waiting to find a site that will give me help with that swap. Maybe there is so much space dedicated to the SR swap because it is so complicated and less so for the KA because it is not. Someone help me out.

I found the info I needed about the body bolts in this site. Thanks. My plan is to remove the body from the frame and store it temporarily while I work on the frame modifications, sandblasting, and powder coating. I also plan to convert to a different caliper for the front brakes and explore converting the back to disc also, probably while changing axles. I printed plans from the site for a support to hold the body. I will be constructing that soon. I am not a welder so I would need to find a welder to do the frame modifications. I understand that the KA engine does not need any modifications to the frame. Any info on where I get mounts and such for that swap?

I have a friend who travels to Florida from California every year to race his RX7 at Sebring in the spring. He is trying to convince me to modify my roadster to race. I checked into it once and found it complicated. I don't know why but the fuel cell idea seemed hard to achieve. Now that I will have the car apart I'm thinking more about that. How do I find someone to convert my gas tank to a fuel cell version? I was checking out suspension rebuild kits that are available for normal and racing uses. I'm torn as to which way to go. I would need different tires and seem to remember that I need to go to an expensive driving school. I bet my son would love to attend with me. He could race the car when I get too old. If I decide to race, which engine would be better the SR20DE or the KA24DE? I understand the SR loves to scream. What does the KA like to do?

Life is short. I'm thinking I might want to race this roadster. Any advice?

[dbrick]

You might want to check the rules for the class you want to race in. A non original engine may bump you into a fast class with much higher safety requirements and less chance of being competitive, while a stock/production/street class may let you keep a stock gas tank among other things. Will has a very competitive car he drives to and from the track.

Just a thought, if that is a clean straight car with a title, it might be a better street car for you or someone else, and find an existing race car or build one from something less pretty and/or without a title for track use only.

From what I've gathered, the KA is a big honking torque producer, the SR is a smooth screamer.

[notoptoy]

Just a hunch, but I bet that group member "dieter ka24de" might be of some help!

[Alvin]

What type of "racing"
Historic? non-stock engines are not allowed with most racing bodies. I would rebuild your R16 or U20 to race spec and have at it! A fuel cell will be the least of your worries though. Extensive roll caging, suspension, fire safety, etc.

Open track days/auto-x? pick any engine swap and enjoy!

The KA is much easier to install, has gobs of hp/tq right out of the box and they are relatively cheap
Finding one that is not beat to hell is the problem, but then again rebuilding is simple and cheap

There are several documented KA24(D)E builds on this site, each with their own solutions to mounting without surgery on the frame for the engine and/or transmission mounts

You will still need to fabricate or buy the engine mounts to use the stock frame engine mounts...these might be currently available from vendors.

as for KA vs SR...imho the SR just feels like a roadster engine. 7500rpm. free to rev. 2.0L. hp ranging from 140 to 200 NA or more for the turbocharged variant
The KA obviously has more displacement(2.4L) and more torque in stock form...but the aftermarket can make it a real monster

does this make you decision easier or tougher

[denniswagnerusa]

I've had a busy day working on my roadster. I found and removed all the bolts holding the body to the frame and was able to lift the body off the frame with a hydraulic jack. I put pieces of wood in between the body and frame and was able to raise the body about three inches. I will build a support attached to the ceiling joists where I can raise the body a little at a time to get enough height to roll the frame from underneath. Here is a photo showing the car raised on wood blocks.

xtn_IMG_5658.JPG

I've decided I'm going to try to find a SR20DE motor to use in my roadster. I do not have the equipment to modify the plumbing needed for a turbo version. Someone recommended that I look locally for an engine. I found a place within a mile of my house that has several turbo SRs but no DEs. They have lousy reviews so I'm glad they don't have my engine.

I have questions about what to do with some of the tubes and wires left in my engine bay. Do I keep the tube used for measuring the oil pressure? I assume the SRs have automatic chokes so I don't need the choke wires. Likewise for the throttle lock. How about the speedometer cable? The steering column looks like it can be removed by pulling it out of the firewall. Is that OK? I have a plastic wire harness connector just inside the firewall near the clutch master cylinder that I cannot disconnect. Are these wires going to be cut anyway? Should I go ahead and cut the wires at the connector so I can remove the wire harness in the engine compartment?

[notoptoy]

DON't Cut any wires, there are plenty of people who would gladly pay for an intact wiring harness!!
There are ways to get the wires out wtihout damaging them.

[zippy67roadster]

Here is a link to a thread on this forum about the engine swap. It should answer a lot of your questions. http://www.311s.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=5128" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. I just finished building the body rack for my vintage race car project and the instructions from the Tech section have been added to to make it more stable. The first thing is you will need 6 2x6x8's not 5! Here is the link to the thread. http://www.311s.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=13757" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. Page 2 is where the pictures and explanation are located.

[pebbles]

Dennis, I didnt cut any wires on my 69, or depin any plugs. The wires should pull through in one direction or another. The grommet holes are big.
SAVE EVERYTHING UNTIL YOU ARE DONE. FWIW.

[denniswagnerusa]

Lots of things going on with the project. The body is off the frame which is degreased and ready to go. I purchased a SR20DET motor from a local source. It is clean and supposedly has low miles (don't they all). I'm having my mechanic rejuvenate the engine with lots of new parts and then I will have him modify the frame using Spriso's jig (when I can get it) and mounts. After the engine is installed on the new mounts and any issues resolved I will take the frame and engine back so that I can work on the brakes and suspension. My plan is to install Volvo calipers and competition springs on the front. I also want to rebuild the front suspension. I originally planned to get the frame sandblasted and powdercoated but I am not seeing lots of advantage to that now. The frame does not have any significant rust after 42 years so I don't see the advantage of paying extra to protect it from rust. I plan to sandblast it myself and paint it with aerosol cans. The logistics of getting the frame to the powdercoater does not seem worth it. I do look forward to having the valve cover powdercoated however.

My mechanic will get the car back to build the custom turbo setup and exhaust. I'm hoping to do the wiring and gauges with his advice. Eventually I want new seats, tires, and wheels. I may invest in a fuel cell since the internal fuel pump will need to be added and I would like the option to race this car in the future.

I am revealing my plans to encourage criticism so that I can avoid expensive and time wasting mistakes. If you have ideas that will help let me know. One criticism you may have is that I am paying my mechanic to do things I can do myself. That is a valid argument. However my time is valuable too and I have a lot going on in my life. It is typical of my projects that I end up redoing things over and over again to get them right. Sometimes that is a great learning experience. Right now I want to share the work so that I am not reworking everything on this project. Besides I cannot weld so some of the stuff will need to be outsourced anyway. I am hoping that by investing in my mechanic he will help me in the parts I decide to do myself.

[denniswagnerusa]

Sorry for the double post. How do you delete a post?

[Alvin]

looking forward to the progress!