Engine swap-related question

[Guest]

Hi, I was wondering if anyone might know how well a (gulp) Toyota 20/22R engine and matching tranny would fit into a '68 1600?

I'm looking into this because I just happened to have a couple of partial 79-83 Celicas available, as well as a 1600 with no engine or tranny...

[Minh]

Good question... I just took a eye balled my Totota 87 pickup and my 68 1600. It has a R22 with a single carb.

I have to say if where there is a will there is a way.

I would measure if there is enough vertical clearance in the Roadster 1st. The block is pretty tall compared to the R16 or U20. That is becuase the carbs sits almost on top of the motor alongside the head.

[Plasmaboy]

I put a Toyota 18RG into a 1600 a few years back with a celica steel case 5 speed . All I had to modify was on the firewall where the transmission tunnel and firewall sheet metal meet there is about a 10 mm protusion into the engine bay , I had to bend the bottom part of the tabs to clear the bellhousing . I even used the original engine mount rubbers .

[Guest]

Sounds like a go, then

Plasmaboy, what did you use for the rear-end and drive axle?

I looked at LCEngineering's engine packages and was reassured about the possible hop-up potential of this engine choice... plus the high availability and low cost of parts.

I would love to go with a complete Datsun/Nissan package, but I'm a guy with limited funds and lots 'o energy. I managed to grab a couple of retired racing Celicas from the local amatuer four cylinder racing class, hopefully I can assemble a nice donor package for the negleted Roadster.

Anyone have any ideas for other parts I can use from the 'toys?

[Plasmaboy]

hi stpeters I used the original diff / rear end as its so solid , all I had to do was get a new tailshaft made to suit . If your going to put a bigger HP engine in the car .. remember to think about uprating the brakes , going fast is fun .. being able to stop will save your life

[topdownfun]

Good point about the brakes. What upgrades are there that will make these little cars stop better? I read about the Volvo front disc conversion, but do the volvo brakes stop better or are they just easier/cheaper to get parts for?

Thanks,

Erik Miller
'70 1600

[Plasmaboy]

Hi topdown fun There are several options for brakes , when I get my act together Ill be sending a write up of the one I have done ( front and rear vented disks ) to 311s for posting . I have even seen pics of 300ZX calipes on standard fairlady disks !

[Minh]

Good point about the brakes. What upgrades are there that will make these little cars stop better? I read about the Volvo front disc conversion, but do the volvo brakes stop better or are they just easier/cheaper to get parts for?

Thanks,

Erik Miller
'70 1600

The Volvo brakes are 4 piston brakes as apposed to the Roadster 2 piston brakes. 2 piston are good cmpared to the 1 piston common on many cars today. The more pistons the more braking pressure applied to the disks for stoppage.

However, more pressure equates to more friction menaing more heat. So, knowing how to brake come into play too. Because, the stock Datsun rotors ar not vented.

SIDE NOTE: It is maybe worth it then to get the $130 BRE airdam that blows air to the front rotors for cooling. Looks cool too.

Yeah the calipers and shoes are very cheap compared to the cost of replacing the stock ones. There is a write up on the website for the conversion.
http://www.311s.org/tech/brakes/brakes.html

[SLOroadster]

With a set of PORTERFIELD front pads and EBC "Green Stuff" rear shoes a roadster will stop fast enough to remove a face lift. The Volvo conversion is neet but way to much work for little perfomace gain (In my opinion) Cross drilled and slotted rotors are out there. If your brakes feel soft, rebleed the system including the master, then check to see if the firewall is cracked under the lower master cylinder mounting stud. If it is you can get a brake brace from either Mike Young or Stan.

Will

[spl310]

A while back, Mark Dent did a cost comparison of the stock parts versus the Volvo conversion. It was posted to the Datsun Roadster e-mail list. The cost was pretty much a wash. If you are doing it for economic means, you are going after the wrong thing. If you want more pad area and more pistons, have at it. The big buy in on the Volvo conversion is the cost of the cores. They are not cheap (out east where I am anyway). If you have access to a machine shop, there are other more economical conversions - such as Z car brakes. Those require mods to the caliper adaptors though.

[Minh]

A while back, Mark Dent did a cost comparison of the stock parts versus the Volvo conversion. It was posted to the Datsun Roadster e-mail list. The cost was pretty much a wash. If you are doing it for economic means, you are going after the wrong thing. If you want more pad area and more pistons, have at it. The big buy in on the Volvo conversion is the cost of the cores. They are not cheap (out east where I am anyway). If you have access to a machine shop, there are other more economical conversions - such as Z car brakes. Those require mods to the caliper adaptors though.

I don't like to promote dishonesty, but some people have gotten away with the core charge by not giving them the exact core. This is what I've heard.

[Guest]

I am not mecahnically inclined but I can tell you that the Volvo calipers make a huge difference! I've driven 7 or 8 roadsters, all with stock brake systems in better than new or rebuilt form. I've even driven a car set up for racing(Carion's) and the braking performance pails in comparison.
Pedal feel is improved, and even the lightest touch will slow the car down. The roadser can now brake like a modern car. No joke.
This is achieved with stock Volvo pads, not performance pad as well.
Slotted/drilled rotors will do nothing for pedal feel, they might decrease brake fade under contant application, but with todays modern pads, de-gassing isn't a problem. In other words, they' re just for show!
Do the conversion.